Multiple Guests

• The words that changed the lives of Margy O'Neill and her son, Matthew (6:33)
• A crazy good turn that started Ken's Krew as an opportunity for the neurodivergent (11:57)
• Crystal Hanlon, a Home Depot executive, explains the training and support that make Ken's Krew so successful (18:39)
• Krewmember and family testimonies that brought Suzy Goldberger - and the rest of the room - to tears (28:14)

FRANK BLAKE: We'll start our conversation with Margy, who discusses a common - and massive - challenge that the families such as hers, with an autistic child, face when those kids reach adulthood.

Here's Margy.

MARGY O'NEILL: As a parent of a young adult with autism, as you get close to that senior year in high school, you go, "What are we going to do?"

So Matthew and I went into the Home Depot blind hoping we could find something, some position for him in the Home Depot.

So he goes into interview, I was with him, but I was sitting outside and he came out of the interview and he said, "They're looking for something."

I said, "Okay, no big deal." And he's like, "They want us to wait."

So we both go back together and they're like, I said, "So Matt's a young adult with autism."

And they're like, "We have got the perfect thing for him."

FRANK BLAKE: So you weren't aware of Ken's Krew before you went in?

MARGY O'NEILL: Not at all. So as a mother of a young adult with autism, I probably did cry.

Those aren't words you hear often, "We have the perfect thing for your child."

And they said, "It's an organization called Ken's Krew. We're a nonprofit."

They explained the whole process of that it's to help train these young adults gain competitive employment.

My mind was blown. How did I not know about this gem?

So we've been off to the races ever since and it was like a duck to water when he started. It was so true. It was the perfect fit.

And you don't hear that too often, right, do we?

MATTHEW O'NEILL: No.

MARGY O'NEILL: No.

MATTHEW O'NEILL: No.

FRANK BLAKE: So our listeners may not, they won't know all the details about Home Depot as Matthew does and as I'm aware of a lot of them.

But we do something with associates where we give out Homer badges.

And Homer badges are a reflection of associates who do great customer service or great things for their other associates.

And Matthew, how long have you been at Home Depot?

MATTHEW O'NEILL: Seven years. This November will be my seven year anniversary.

FRANK BLAKE: Well, congratulations. So it's not easy to get Homer badges. We have a lot of associates.

There are by, sort of on purpose, this is meant to be a very significant recognition.

Matthew has had in his seven years, 24 Homer badges. Is that right?

MATTHEW O'NEILL: That is correct.

FRANK BLAKE: Congratulations. That's phenomenal.

You have also, so the way the system works at Home Depot is you get a certain number of badges and you go from silver to gold, et cetera.

The highest level is platinum when you've achieved number... And how many platinum badges do you have?

MATTHEW O'NEILL: As of right now, I have two platinum badges.

FRANK BLAKE: That's incredible.

I can tell from my own time at Home Depot that it really is impressive when an associate earns a platinum badge, not to mention two platinum badges.

Because one thing I saw time and again at Home Depot was how beloved Ken's Krewmembers were to their customers and associates alike.

That's why it's a great privilege to introduce you to the woman who's been serving as executive director of Ken's Krew since 2013, Suzy Goldberger.

Suzy, welcome. I'd love to start out by asking: When did you first hear about Ken's Krew?

SUZY GOLDBERGER: Well, I heard about it pretty much from the beginning.

My business partner, Michael Solomon, founded Ken's Krew with his wife, Connie, and Karen LaPera. So I heard about it from the side from day one.

I got involved maybe 20 years ago, maybe a little more than that because they asked me, as a favor, to do the books. So that's how I got involved originally.

I started helping out and I got sucked deeper and deeper into it because I love it.

I think what they do is amazing.

I think we have an incredible staff who have been with us, many of them, for a long time, some since the beginning, and they do great work and I'm in awe of what they do.

I couldn't do what they do, but I am very much in awe of it.

FRANK BLAKE: What were the things that attracted you to it? How did you get drawn into it?

SUZY GOLDBERGER: Because I think what they do is so meaningful.

Giving this population, individuals with a neurodevelopmental cognitive disability, the opportunity to work and help themselves, and in many cases, help their families is a very specific opportunity to fill a need that really, really makes a difference.

You may not be aware of this, but the department of labor publishes statistics about employment and specifically includes employment of people with disabilities, and only 22% of adults with disabilities are employed, which is really shameful.

It is extremely hard for adults with disabilities to find employment.

But what this organization has shown is that you can not only work with these adults, these individuals and help them find employment, but we could help them keep employment.

And that's the part that's even better, that it works.

These individuals, our Krewmembers we call them, not only get a job, but stay with the job and have a career.

And that's something that, unfortunately, for many people in their situation, is not even a possibility.

FRANK BLAKE: And how did the connection with Home Depot grow?

I assume it started with Ken Langone.

SUZY GOLDBERGER: Yes. So my partner, Michael Solomon, who I mentioned, Michael, and Connie, and Karen LaPera, who runs the organization still today, were parents of children with disabilities.

And they were facing the prospect that their children would be leaving the school system.

Every state has a different age limit for how long special needs children can stay within the school system. In some cases, it's 21, in some cases, it's even older, in some cases, younger.

And they realized that their kids having been in this safe environment for so many years, were going to be sent out into the world with no idea what they would do.

And they spend about a year, the three of them, brainstorming ideas for starting businesses, all kinds of things from farming to starting a store, you name it.

And Michael and Ken were friends. Ken heard about this effort and said, "Look, I can get you a job at a store at a Home Depot, and why don't you see if that makes sense?"

And so Michael and Ken sponsored this, put up the money to start the organization.

They used that initial funding to hire a vocational trainer, found one young adult and trained that young adult in a store in Philadelphia for a year figuring out how to make it work, get the kinks out of the system, and it worked.

And from there, grew the organization very slowly.

There's always been a huge focus by both Michael and Ken on the quality of the program. And I think that's a very big differentiating factor.

But today, we are somewhere in the next few months going to train our thousandth worker.

FRANK BLAKE: Wow.

SUZY GOLDBERGER: We're up to 974 that we've trained, so we're very, very close.

But I think the most important thing is... Having founded the organization in 1998, so it's 27 years old.

Of those 974 individuals who we've trained through Ken's Krew, 522 of them are still working today.

FRANK BLAKE: Really?

SUZY GOLDBERGER: Their jobs. I'm going-

FRANK BLAKE: They're not still working at Home Depot, just somewhere else or-

SUZY GOLDBERGER: Nope. Most of them at Home Depot.

FRANK BLAKE: Most of them at Home Depot. Isn't that amazing?

SUZY GOLDBERGER: And let me give you a couple of numbers here. I don't want to throw too many numbers-

FRANK BLAKE: Yeah. No, please. Please.

SUZY GOLDBERGER: I think this is great.

So we have 100 members who stayed in their job for at least 10 years.

We have another 34 who were employed for at least 15 years, 28 who were employed for more than 20 years, and six who have celebrated 25th anniversaries, and -

FRANK BLAKE: That's -

SUZY GOLDBERGER: I think all of them at Home Depot.

FRANK BLAKE: - spectacular. I mean, we always at Home Depot would talk about our stores as family. Your associates in the store are part of your extended family.

And that's a proof point of it. Right?

SUZY GOLDBERGER: I think it really is.

And I think we bless Home Depot for the relationship, but I think it very much works because of the culture at Home Depot, that it's not just about us, it is a family.

It is about the store associates and the store management working together, helping each other, helping each other through hard times.

And I think that culture made it easier for us, so we're very, very grateful to have that relationship.

FRANK BLAKE: That sense of "family" Suzy describes isn't just something given from The Home Depot to Ken's Krew.

The Krewmembers do a whole lot to deepen that "family" feeling inside their stores. Crystal Hanlon has seen this firsthand on countless occasions.

During her 40-year career at Home Depot, she's served at nearly every level. She started as a cashier, worked her way up as a manager in the stores, and eventually became the president of the north region for eight years, a huge job within Home Depot.

She's seen up close the difference Ken's Krew makes in the lives of associates, customers, and store teams alike.

CRYSTAL HANLON: Oh, I love Ken's Krew, because let me tell you, the partnership is incredible because Ken's Krew associates that come into the store, our leadership teams work with them and they get so excited about the opportunity.

Typically, you'll see a Ken's Krew associate that is smiling, eager to be there, looking forward to the opportunity of waiting on a customer.

And it's kind of contagious because the customers love them and they just provide an avenue for us to make a difference together.

And it really represents the communities that we live in.

I mean, the customers love it, the associates love it, and our store leadership teams are totally engaged in the stores that we have it in and it provides such a wealth of togetherness to make a difference.

FRANK BLAKE: So I was in one of our stores over this past weekend and talking to an associate there when I gave her one of this that we were having this topic for the podcast, she pulls out her iPhone and shows a photo with the Ken's Krew team and points out one of the associates who'd been in the store for, I want to say 15 years now, and who'd just gotten married, which is a pretty amazing story.

CRYSTAL HANLON: That's an awesome story. And you hear story after story.

When I used to be a division president walking the stores in the north that had it, I'd ask, "How's the program going? Are you supporting the program?"

I got raving reviews from our leadership teams about the associates and how much they care and their passion and the fact that they grow into these great associates by learning and finding the right path for them in the store.

And it really builds unity amongst the store leadership teams and our associates. And it's really a positive program.

We've had a lot of positive impacts. The leaders were very excited about it as well as myself.

I've walked with many Ken's Krew associates, seen them waiting on customers, seen the interactions, and typically it is an exciting experience to watch them because they're so passionate about what they do and the opportunities they have.

And they're part of our family, they become part of our family.

FRANK BLAKE: That's so true. That's such a great description.

And what, Crystal, is the process? How does the store, how does it work?

CRYSTAL HANLON: Well, there's 500 Ken's Krew members and it's in 160 stores.

And the way that we do it is they tailor the training to the ability of each team member.

So they tailor the training based off the individual needs and they work for six to eight weeks to make sure they provide a good training platform from a base.

And then their vocational coordinators work with them to continue the training.

And our store leadership team works with them on customer service and teaches them different avenues for what they need to do to wait on the customer and build unity with the associates.

And it really is a living, breathing machine because it doesn't just stop with that eight weeks on training.

It continues as they focus on what they do in their daily roles. And the store leadership team works to find, where is the right spot in the store for the associate?

If somebody doesn't want to be around a lot of people, we have so many different roles and responsibilities, we can find the great spot for them and typically they grow in that role.

We've got some associates that are 20, 25 year associates that are in Ken's Krew and they just keep on growing.

And watching them grow, because sometimes in the north I see the same individuals at different stores and watching their confidence and seeing them grow and grow, it just is a beautiful thing because you've been part of something grand to make a difference.

FRANK BLAKE: The person we featured at the start of our show, Matthew O'Neill, is a perfect example of what Crystal is talking about here.

His mother Margy has watched him grow in knowledge, skill and confidence every year.

Did you think this might go for many years, that it was going to connect, or who knew?

MARGY O'NEILL: So with us, it's kind of like one day at a time and maybe just one year at a time and see how it goes.

When he tells me each year what the anniversary is, I go, "Didn't you just start last year?"

Seven years has gone by really quick.

MATTHEW O'NEILL: Yes, it has.

FRANK BLAKE: And maybe talk a little bit about some of the help that Ken's Krew has given over the time.

MARGY O'NEILL: So when things come up and situations happen, customers are random. And I just mean that you never know.

I mean, as typical people, we don't know what people are going to say.

So for somebody who is, uh, who has autism and you don't know what's going to come at you, and young adults with autism don't wear a sign, "I'm autistic."

So somebody approaches you and asks you some complex question, Matthew usually just guides them to where they need to be.

But sometimes customers get really frustrated that he doesn't have the answer because he looks like a guy that would.

To describe him, he's five foot 10, over 200 pounds, big muscles, he's bald as an eagle, and he's got a walk that looks like he owns the place and that's who he's always been.

That's just the way he was, his natural walk.

So I think people come up, and this is a tough part for all of us, come up with an expectation of who they're about to talk to.

So they have this question and then he simply says, "I can tell you who to go see." And sometimes they get instantly frustrated.

So then I'm able to contact my Ken's Krew people, Debbie Callahan, Karen LaPara, Beth Ann, and I go, "Okay, we have a situation." And they're on it.

They're like, the supports go in place immediately. And they're talking with him, they talk to the managers, the support is there so that sometimes they just talk to the managers.

And the managers also intercede.

The union between Ken's Krew and the management at the Home Depot is also amazing. It's flawless, it's seamless.

They're one together, because we all have the same mission.

And then when things happen at the Home Depot, there was a situation recently where something happened at his store and they had the supports in place before even the workers knew it happened. They can anticipate needs.

It's been, you don't get that in the workplace.

FRANK BLAKE: Making this program work takes serious commitment.

Ken's Krew and The Home Depot have both stepped up repeatedly throughout their history.

Ken's Krew actively seeks out and hires full-time vocational coaches, who provide ongoing mentoring and support for program participants.

Meanwhile, The Home Depot Foundation has made several grants to support expanding the program to more locations.

Here's Suzy Goldberger on how that growth has affected the organization.

What have you observed as the changes over the time? Is the program now easier?

Do the difficulties remain the same? Every store is similar? What's changed?

SUZY GOLDBERGER: I think a lot of things have changed over time.

One of the things that differentiates us from other agencies that do similar things is that we give our members lifetime support for the length of their time in the program.

And that's expensive.

It's a very high-touch thing, and most agencies simply don't have the funding to do that, and we understand that.

But what it means is that we are constantly reinforcing the work skills and the social skills, and a lot of our job with the individuals who are members of our program is more about the social skills than the work skills.

Many of them are perfectly able to pick up the needs of the job quickly.

And I should emphasize that all of our members, all of our workers are in customer-facing situations.

None of them are held at the back of the store, held out of sight. We wouldn't do that.

That's a very, very big thing for us, that everybody should be treated with respect and should be treated the way any other worker would be treated.

But a lot of what we do is this constant refreshing of skills.

So we also run a social program as social/networking program that we call the Krew where we hold meetings.

And it's changed a little bit because, these days, a lot of those meetings are held over Zoom rather than in person.

But we are constantly refreshing the skills, giving training for things that will help them in the workplace, and of course, offering social opportunities.

So things that we wouldn't have even thought about 25 years ago, things like sexual harassment training, we do that routinely now.

Every one of our members goes through that. We reinforce it. Not that it didn't exist 25 years ago, but we just weren't thinking that way.

So there's always new things for us to learn that we need to go over with our workers.

And I will say, as a result of our Krew meetings, we just recently celebrated the engagement of two of our workers who met at a Krew meeting.

They work at two different Home Depot stores, met at a Krew meeting. So that was very exciting as well.

So it's social as well as refresher skills, but having to keep up with things is very important. And we do that and we keep our workers up with things.

And by giving that ongoing support, not only through Krew meetings, but all of our vocational trainers stop by the stores every six to eight weeks to check on every worker.

And it's a relationship that we have with the store management that I think makes the program work as well, because store managers and assistant managers are very free to call our vocational trainers if there's any issues.

And issues can be positive or negative.

Negative is there's some behavior that's inappropriate or something they're doing, the trainer will come in the store the next day and we'll work with the young man or the young woman and we'll address the issues and get them back on track.

And, usually, that's pretty easy to do.

Or in many cases, it's positive.

A store manager will say, "We want to give this worker more responsibility. Can you come in and train them for the new job?"

And we're thrilled to do that.

FRANK BLAKE: Do you get other organizations that contact you and say, "How has this been successful for Ken's Krew? What can we learn from Ken's Krew?"

SUZY GOLDBERGER: Yeah, we interact a lot with other organizations.

They're contacting us, we're contacting them, and we're very happy to do so.

I mean, the people that work in the nonprofit world, by definition, are philanthropic of their time, and we all want to know how we can do it better.

So we have spent a fair amount of time with other organizations and freely share ideas and practices and sometimes even work together to see if we can do something better.

FRANK BLAKE: Do you have some favorite stories, some things that particularly touched you or impressed you or inspired you?

SUZY GOLDBERGER: I have a lot of stories. I'll try to keep it to a couple.

One was a story in your hometown in Atlanta.

We had opened up in Atlanta a number of years ago. We were relatively new to the area, so we didn't have a lot of workers there yet.

And we held a small Christmas party for them in the break room of a Home Depot. I think it was in Buckhead or somewhere like that.

And it was a Sunday in December when people have other things to do, and we had our workers and their families come in.

And a few of the Home Depot managers and even a district manager asked if they could join us, which I thought, for them to give up a Sunday evening before Christmas, was pretty unusual.

But we said, of course, they're welcome. And we had this little small celebration.

And we asked our workers to stand up and say what it meant to them to have a job, and it was very sweet.

But then, unplanned, their parents started standing up and saying not just what it meant for their children in terms of the confidence that their children got, the pride that they had, the pride about bringing home a paycheck, but the parents said it changed the whole family's life because it really meant such a change in their child's life.

And in many cases, frankly, just bringing home that extra paycheck made a big change to the whole family.

And the Home Depot managers had tears pouring down their faces. They were bawling. I started bawling. I couldn't help it.

But it was one of the most meaningful experiences because as much as these managers loved their workers and were really fond of them, they never appreciated what it meant to the families.

And it was a big eye-opener for everybody, including myself, to hear the families describe how it changed things, getting Johnny off the couch into a job every day, everything about it made their family's lives better.

So that was a, you know, incredibly emotional experience all around that I loved.

FRANK BLAKE: That's a wonderful story. That is just such a wonderful story.

And for all of us recognizing the importance of work and the pride of work and how that helps you not only on your job, but then when you go home, it's just such a great story.

SUZY GOLDBERGER: Thank you. Yeah, I love that one.

I have two other favorite stories.

So one was I was walking around a store, the King of Prussia store in the Philadelphia area, with the store manager. And he was walking me through the cleaning products aisles, the Windex and the Clorox, those bottles.

And he showed me that the shelves were immaculately lined up with product. There were no holes in the shelves, every bottle was in order.

And he had a young man who worked in the store, and an element of his disability was, I guess, a little bit of OCD, and he was continuously walking through these aisles and moving the product around and fixing it and straightening it.

And the manager said to me that you wouldn't believe how that drives sales because customers like seeing that orderly shelving.

And he said it really made a difference to the sales of these products. So it was a classic example of taking somebody's disability and turning it into an advantage.

And that's what we try to do is instead of seeing people's disabilities, show their abilities, show what they can do and show off those abilities so that the disabilities disappear.

FRANK BLAKE: And, Suzy, since I know you also as an incredibly savvy business person, why do you think programs like this aren't more widespread?

SUZY GOLDBERGER: Well, I admit that I'm a little befuddled by that one.

We would ideally like to have one or two more national employers so that we're not completely a Home Depot operation.

Although I have to admit that Home Depot is a very safe and comfortable position to be in.

And we have seen employers balk. We give them the data, we have a lot of data, we show them the data, we show them the cost savings, we show them the benefits.

A lot of them talk a very good game about wanting to do good things.

I know that DEI is less fashionable today than it was, but even when it was at its peak, a lot of employers talk about it, but their actions are a lot less than their talk.

So I can't explain it because this, to me, makes a lot of sense. I can't explain why other people don't embrace it as they should.

FRANK BLAKE: Yeah, it's a different kind of diversity and maybe people are just...

There are a lot of interesting prejudices that apply to it that are hard to get over. Yeah.

SUZY GOLDBERGER: Which is unfortunate.

But as I said at the beginning, unfortunately, it's very hard for individuals with disabilities to find employment.

FRANK BLAKE: Yeah. And talk for a minute, if you would, about the people you have, who are the trainers, the people who work with these associates, because that must be an extraordinary group as well.

SUZY GOLDBERGER: They really are. And we're very, very lucky because we are a fairly dispersed organization.

We have always operated on a shoestring because our mantra has been that we want to put every dollar we raise into the program and into the young adults and try to spend as little as possible on administration.

And we operate in 10 states now.

So we have vocational trainers in every state, but they're very much solo operators. We have a buddy system.

We have two trainers at least in every state, but they don't have the full backup of many other organizations. So they have to be somewhat self-starters.

They are people with different qualifications. Many of them come out of the special education world. Many of them have advanced degrees.

Some of them are former teachers, former social workers, but different caring professions.

And this is not an easy job. They have a great deal of empathy for this workforce.

They're able to communicate beautifully and they end up loving what they do, which is what we love about them because anybody that loves their job does it better.

FRANK BLAKE: And probably a huge range of people, both ages, different kinds of disabilities, it's probably a broad range that they have to deal with as well.

SUZY GOLDBERGER: A very broad range.

And we don't distinguish between disabilities. We will work with any disability.

Some individuals are higher functioning than others.

Unfortunately, the image that we see on television is often the genius with a disability, that's not what it is in real life.

It's people with a range of issues. Some of them they were born with, some of them happened by accident.

But our vocational trainers are able to draw out the good and the positive in everybody and find a place for them.

FRANK BLAKE: So I've got two final questions for you.

First is, did you think, as you were embarking on your career, which is a distinguished career in business, that you would also be doing something like this?

Was that a natural... Were you looking for an additional outlet or was this a surprise?

SUZY GOLDBERGER: Never thought I would be doing this. I had no connection to the disability community before this, but I could not be more pleased that I am doing it.

I think it's opened up something in me that I didn't know could be there. It's opened up empathy.

It's opened up a warmth and understanding that people can be different from me and we still have much in common.

So nothing that I planned, but I couldn't be happier to be spending time on this.

FRANK BLAKE: So I ask everybody who appears on this podcast a question at the end, which is, who has done a crazy good turn for you in your life?

You're doing crazy good turn for hundreds of associates in Home Depot stores. Who has done a crazy good turn for you, Suzy?

SUZY GOLDBERGER: I really have to say it's my partner, Michael Solomon.

He hired me over 40 years ago as a kid out of school, I didn't know anything about anything, I had no experience at anything, and he hired me to work at one of the premier investment banks in the world, Lazard Freres.

He thought out of the Ivy League box. I wouldn't have a career if he hadn't taken a chance on me. So, absolutely, that's my crazy good turn.

FRANK BLAKE: Since we ask every guest about the person who's done a crazy good turn for them, we wanted to make sure we also heard from Matthew and Margy.

So I ask this question to everybody who is on the podcast.

Let me ask each of you, and it doesn't have to be related to Home Depot or Ken's Krew or anything, but just who's done something great for you in your lives?

MARGY O'NEILL: You want to think about that for a second?

MATTHEW O'NEILL: Yeah.

MARGY O'NEILL: I'm going to go ahead and say that day standing in the office when they said, "We have the perfect," I'm going to cry. "We have the perfect thing."

The fact that Ken's Krew, I didn't know it existed, so that was a little miracle for me. And it doesn't get better than that.

FRANK BLAKE: Well said, well said.

MARGY O'NEILL: You don't know?

MATTHEW O'NEILL: I don't know.

FRANK BLAKE: That's okay.

MARGY O'NEILL: What about Tanisha?

MATTHEW O'NEILL: When I started, I had Tanisha Carroll as my supervisor.

And let me tell you, she was amazing. She's been there for me ever since. I started day one, which was November 11th, 2018.

MARGY O'NEILL: How old were you?

MATTHEW O'NEILL: I was 19 at the time, and I'll be 27 in December. And-

MARGY O'NEILL: Tanisha would say when she met him, he didn't talk, but she always felt like, she goes, "I watched him come out of his shell."

She is a hero among heroes. Yep. They're all good, but Tanisha -

FRANK BLAKE: Tanisha in particular.

MATTHEW O'NEILL: Yeah, we had a very, very close connection.

FRANK BLAKE: That's awesome. That is awesome.

And again, for those who haven't worked in a place like Home Depot, you get a good supervisor or a good assistant store manager or a great store manager, and wow, does that make a difference.

MARGY O'NEILL: It's everything.

FRANK BLAKE: It's everything.

MARGY O'NEILL: And then you throw in Debbie Callahan who's as cool as a cucumber and just, "We're going to work through it."

And you have Beth Ann and you have Karen and an amazing team.

And they're our heroes too, because it doesn't matter. We text them, call, they're always there, always.

FRANK BLAKE: Well, thank you very much. Really appreciate your spending the time to give a little perspective on Ken's Krew.

MARGY O'NEILL: We appreciate it.